Joe the Plumber In-Law to Charles Keating? of the McCain S&L Scandal

News Type: Event — Seeded on Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:08 PM EDT

Article Source: The New York Times

politics, john-mccain, keating-5, joe-wurzelbacher, charles-keating, robert-wurzelbacher

Joe Wurzelbacher is cousin to Roger Wurzelbacher of Milton Ohio in-law to Charles H Keating of the S&L scandal for which John McCain was censured by congress. This is according to Martin Eisenstardt a conservative blogger.

The depth of the relationship regardless, this only highlights the Savings and Loans mess that characterized the same kind of banking disaster hitting the country today and McCain had to make sure we all take the history lesson on his involvement.

The single bank fraud count carries a maximum five-year prison sentence and $250,000 fine. The judge agreed to delay sentencing until June 1 after Michael Lightfoot, a defense lawyer, and David Sklansky, an assistant United States attorney, said Mr. Dickson was cooperating with prosecutors.

Mr. Lightfoot would not discuss the case with reporters.

Mr. Dickson was the fifth former associate to agree to testify against Mr. Keating. Mr. Dickson was convicted last week in a California court on 17 of 18 counts of securities fraud and faces up to 10 years in prison and a $250,000 fine.

Mr. Dickson was a close aide to Mr. Keating and worked with Mr. Keating's son-in-law, Robert Wurzelbacher, a senior vice president of American Continental.

Read more at this conservative blog of Martin Eisenstardt

http://www.eisenstadtgroup.com/2008/10/15/joe-the-plumber-wurzelbacher-related-to-charles-keating-oops/.

The truth about small business taxes: http://money.cnn.com/2008/10/15/smallbusiness/small_biz_taxes_factcheck.smb/index.htm.

Published to:

J. Richter's Column, All of Newsvine
Groups: Alternative Energy - Greenvine, Army4Truth, Election News, Environment, Newsvine Community, ObamaExpress, ObamaVine, Oil, Skeptics, The Big 2008 Election, The Truth Network
Regions: New York

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{"commentId":3540699,"authorDomain":"IndependentVoter"}

IndependentVoter

So What?

{"commentId":3540699,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"IndependentVoter"}

1 vote

#26 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:13 PM EDT

{"commentId":3540793,"authorDomain":"gregfountain"}

greg90815

Wow.

{"commentId":3540793,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"gregfountain"}

1 vote

#27 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:18 PM EDT

{"commentId":3541232,"authorDomain":"bcmadden1025"}

CLM-256248

sorry wrong reply button

{"commentId":3541232,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"bcmadden1025"}

1 vote

#27.1 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:41 PM EDT

{"commentId":3541767,"authorDomain":"luckybaby2469"}

Bebe-2488

BTW Keating also got McCain's career started along with his wife's pappy and mob ties and McCain had his own to with Joe Bonnano.Talking about association we all know about Gordon Liddy a convicted felon from the Nixon Era the Watergate scandal and would kill anyone who got in his way.That's his good buddy who has pure hate in him.Oh yea and that woman who shot a Drin the 90's at a abortion clinic who is now a McCain delegate and calls her a wonderful lady.I've seen this woman's story she was insane and believed God told her to go kill these people.He's complaining about Ayers and ACORN?

{"commentId":3541767,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"luckybaby2469"}

#28 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 8:09 PM EDT

{"commentId":3542174,"authorDomain":"papacliff"}

Cliff CarsonDeleted

{"commentId":3543161,"authorDomain":"uncleandy"}

uncleandy

Shaun, that is not exactly true. If you have been approved as an S Corp by the IRS, that may happen. However, you cannot buy and S Corp. by simply selling the stock in the company to someone else. In the case of a company making more than $250k a year, you are probably not an S corp. You're an everyday "C" corporation meaning it is not necessary for you to pay yourself more than 250K a year.

Joe the Plumber's basic argument was "buying" a company that made more than 250K a year therefore he "personally" would pay more taxes.

To buy this company out right as he is suggesting means it is most likely not an S corp. but a C corp. meaning he is buying all the stock in the company, not just the assets.

Understand, Corporations technically do not pay taxes, the customers of the Corporation do. If Joe the Plumber decides to pay himself more than 250K a year in salary, then yes, he would pay more taxes on his income. On the other hand, if he paid himself less than 250K a year, and reinvested the left over income of the company back into the company, he would not be affected. In other words, he could pay himself 249,999 a year, buy himself a tricked out new truck and hire a few helpers to grow his business.

that is essentially the Obama plan.

{"commentId":3543161,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"uncleandy"}

4 votes

#30 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 9:46 PM EDT

{"commentId":3547698,"authorDomain":"sguido"}

Shaun Guidolin

agreed .. and as this story develops it seems to change anyway. Somehow this guy cannot figure out that *paying* $200k for a business doesn't mean that's income.

{"commentId":3547698,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"sguido"}

1 vote

#30.1 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 9:42 AM EDT

{"commentId":3544109,"authorDomain":"indebted"}

in debt to the company store

F*cking A....Does ANYONE in the McCain camp ever bother to do a Google search?

You took the words right out of my month. Plus I wanted your question in my comments section. Thanks!

{"commentId":3544109,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"indebted"}

1 vote

#31 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 11:02 PM EDT

{"commentId":3544919,"authorDomain":"alkhidr"}

AlKhidr

Certainly not McCain. He thinks a blog is that slime that attacked Steve McQueen in a 1950's Sci-Fi horror flick.

{"commentId":3544919,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"alkhidr"}

3 votes

#31.1 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:20 AM EDT

{"commentId":3544907,"authorDomain":"alkhidr"}

AlKhidr

I thought the GOP touting Joe Sixpack was bad enough for a strategy. Now we have Joe the plumber who actually doesn't even have a plumbing license. Therefore he is not a plumber but a guy with pipe dreams lugging around pipes for a guy who IS a plumber. What a farce for the McPain team. If they would do a little digging, they'd recall that the last time a Republican relied on plumbers to help fix an election, he ended up in hot water.

{"commentId":3544907,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"alkhidr"}

3 votes

#32 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:19 AM EDT

{"commentId":3545070,"authorDomain":"SuaSponte"}

Bad Karma

And if he is? How does that change the O's "spread the wealth"? How does that change anything he believes in? It makes no difference. Look, it's all about a three letter word, J.O.B.S The O got called out and he made his feelings known, if you make money and work hard, he wants that re-distibuted to those that didn't. It's really that simple.

Spread the wealth, it's good for everybody....except between the earned and un-earned...

{"commentId":3545070,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"SuaSponte"}

#33 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:37 AM EDT

{"commentId":3545216,"authorDomain":"indebted"}

in debt to the company store

Why it matters is because a number of the same people running McCain's campaign will end up with choice political assignments, and thus to some extent will be running the country. To me it matters a great deal. So how would you rate them so far?

{"commentId":3545216,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"indebted"}

1 vote

#33.1 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:58 AM EDT

{"commentId":3545299,"authorDomain":"SuaSponte"}

Bad Karma

Ok, so it doesn't matter that he wants to "spread the wealth". And nobody in the O campaign would end up with choice political assignments. That's a pipe-dream.

{"commentId":3545299,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"SuaSponte"}

#33.2 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 1:10 AM EDT

{"commentId":3546232,"authorDomain":"alkhidr"}

AlKhidr

And you're happy with Bush's "spread the wealth" of the last eight years? If you don't have a job (Joe the plumber doesn't have a legal job so his money is ill-gotten gains anyway), what wealth is there to spread around?

{"commentId":3546232,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"alkhidr"}

2 votes

#33.3 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 5:08 AM EDT

{"commentId":3546522,"authorDomain":"SuaSponte"}

Bad Karma

So the answer once again is to take from those who have worked for it to give it to those who haven't.....makes perfect sense..

{"commentId":3546522,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"SuaSponte"}

#33.4 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 6:55 AM EDT

{"commentId":3547766,"authorDomain":"sguido"}

Shaun Guidolin

I would say Bush's plan is more "spread to the wealth" than spread the wealth. Rob the poor to pay off the rich. Such a backwards way to do economics and no wonder everything is toppling over.

Like everything else, and economy is only as strong as it's base... and yes the scary "spread the wealth" strengthens the base.

And you know what that stronger base does? Yes it buys goods and services that - yep you guessed it - support the top of the food chain. This is how a proper money trail works.

If you funnel in money at the top - where does it go? A better idea would have been to take that 450 billion and spread it out and give it to every american to spend on anything they chose - within a 60 day time period (a voucher if you will).. which would spur the economy from the bottom up.

Instead the US government are playing a dangerous game in playing the stock market every day - hoping that goes up.

{"commentId":3547766,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"sguido"}

2 votes

#33.5 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 9:48 AM EDT

{"commentId":3550795,"authorDomain":"JRichter"}

J. Richter

Bad Karma, As a conservative, I have figured out the past 8 years why the trickle down aspect of my movement does not work. (However, if you believe Clinton ratio of taxation betwen rich and poor is spreading the wealth and that it hurt the economy or hurt the rich compared to Bush that gave more to the rich and hurt everyone including the rich, then we will have had a respectful but fundamental disagreement. Otherwise we can focus on the phrase spread the wealth or look at what they mean by their proposed application of their taxation policies.) When the middle does not grow, the top 6% suffer and shrink because they come from the middle and because they need the middle to create wealth.

So, what is needed is a balance - not to penalize the rich and stiffling growth and not to strangle the middle or strangle infrastructure development and other essential government economic growth impetus and increase deficit and deficit interests. The Bush economy over the past 8 years has skewed toward the end where the rich have received more stimulus and much of the excess disposable simply went into overseas luxuries and foreign investments (the green dollar is not red white and blue). Focusing the cuts on the middle results in more of it staying here, more going to the rich and top in increased consumer spending and more in the middle growing into the rich.

I see Obama's policies as more balanced for the country right now and he having the better character and temperament that suits the job. I remain socially conservative and see McCain's character for what it is - bereft of much integrity and honor at this point and short on rational and strategic planning and ability.

I found this editorial below an extremely useful summary that reflects a fair appraisal in the most parts to why Obama would make the better president. Although in my opinion, the choice is not that close. Country first before idealogy.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/10/16/AR2008101603436.html

{"commentId":3550795,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"JRichter"}

2 votes

#33.6 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:56 PM EDT

{"commentId":3550871,"authorDomain":"JRichter"}

J. Richter

Thanks Shaun Gouidolin, your post does highlight a nuanced aspect of economic policy not included in my response.

{"commentId":3550871,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"JRichter"}

1 vote

#33.7 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 1:00 PM EDT

{"commentId":3560152,"authorDomain":"SuaSponte"}

Bad Karma

Honestly I still don't see how you can make poor people rich by taking from those that have and giving it to them...We bump up the minimum wage, personally I see that as roadblock for success. Is there anyone that really wakes up one day thinking, man working for minimum wage and not progressing, that's my goal in life. I mean do people want to maintain an income of that nature. Yes there are those that do have to settle for that, whatever the reason, but I believe it's in Americans nature not to just "settle" for what they have, to progress, to become more productive members not just in society, but for their families also. Unfortunately the drumbeat has been you have, I don't, so give it to me. Yes I know this is somewhat of a blanket statement, but I also know I wasn't born with the silver spoon and had to work my way up and out. So I do all this work and finally make something of myself and business, start making a decent income and now I have to "spread the wealth". We keep talking about fairness, I don't see anything fair about that at all, I see that as an outright punishment for succeeding.

{"commentId":3560152,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"SuaSponte"}

#33.8 - Sat Oct 18, 2008 3:20 AM EDT

{"commentId":3560164,"authorDomain":"jbdaad"}

jbdaad

The Zeitgeist Movement.This might help you understand.

{"commentId":3560164,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"jbdaad"}

#33.9 - Sat Oct 18, 2008 3:23 AM EDT

{"commentId":3568103,"authorDomain":"JRichter"}

J. Richter

Its about helping you on the way up so you get there, BadKarma, so more get there. The top 6% are not going to get anywhere near Clinton or even Eisenhower tax rate under the Obama proposal.

And agreed no one should settle for minimum wage. Its supposed to be a temporary stop on the way up like when you are a student, an apprentice, a recent divorcee, during retraining, or a change of career when your job is shipped off or other loss situation. There should be fairness to that class as well so they can pick up and join the top middle and later top 6% and hire others that were once like them.

Now the Obama cuts are designed to go to this class as well as the big middle. Now it would be nice not to make up for it partially from the top 6% but then the deficit continues to grow as well as its attendant crushing interests and becoming beholden to China and other countries - the bills have to be paid. Its about choices and priorities and where one should call for a sarifice from. The cuts to the top in the past 8 years together with the wars have only continued to grow the deficit, clearly. It is a redestribution of priorities and balances - we ned to sarifice, we have the choice of asking from the middle or the top and rebalancing the economy internally.

If the big middle is strangled, the top suffer also as purchasing power goes down and the entire economy slowly grinds to a halt. The fairness you tout has been practiced for 8 years and its flaws exposed.

{"commentId":3568103,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"JRichter"}

1 vote

#33.10 - Sat Oct 18, 2008 8:17 PM EDT

{"commentId":3572549,"authorDomain":"SuaSponte"}

Bad Karma

The fairness you tout has been practiced for 8 years and its flaws exposed.

Much as the "fairness" that's been tried over the past sixty five years has been shown to be a farce and obviously isn't working. But we won't speak of that.

{"commentId":3572549,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"SuaSponte"}

#33.11 - Sun Oct 19, 2008 9:24 AM EDT

{"commentId":3545335,"authorDomain":"rluck8"}

plumbing

You don't need to have a lic. to own a plumbing business. You only need a person Who sold you the business to have a lic. and hold 10% of the company so it can be done depending on the state. May be the inspector is wrong! Like alot of this election. People wake up and get your facts straight!!!

{"commentId":3545335,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"rluck8"}

#34 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 1:15 AM EDT

{"commentId":3545558,"authorDomain":"mcghiey1"}

aNgRyDuCk

LMAO, classic

{"commentId":3545558,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"mcghiey1"}

#35 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 1:45 AM EDT

{"commentId":3545906,"authorDomain":"averagejane2"}

AverageJane2

ROTFLMAO! That poor schmuck McCain. Foiled again!

Thought he had an ace in the whole at the end of the run and he got a royal flush instead.

{"commentId":3545906,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"averagejane2"}

2 votes

#36 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 2:53 AM EDT

{"commentId":3552838,"authorDomain":"papacliff"}

Cliff CarsonDeleted

{"commentId":3553213,"authorDomain":"d-re-01"}

doc4600

Joe doesn't seem to past the smell test. Just another plant.

{"commentId":3553213,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"d-re-01"}

2 votes

#38 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:23 PM EDT

{"commentId":3571708,"authorDomain":"bmxc50"}

bmxc50

ARIZONA

WURZELBACHER, ROGER
PHOENIX, AZ 85016
SELF-EMPLOYED DECONCINI, DENNIS (D)
Senate - AZ
DENNIS DECONCINI REELECTION COMMITTEE $500
primary 02/19/82
WURZELBACHER, ROGER MRS
PHOENIX, AZ 85016
SELF-EMPLOYED DECONCINI, DENNIS (D)
Senate - AZ
DENNIS DECONCINI REELECTION COMMITTEE $500
primary 02/19/82
WURZELBACHER, ROGER
PHOENIX, AZ 85016
SELF-EMPLOYED DECONCINI, DENNIS (D)
Senate - AZ
DENNIS DECONCINI REELECTION COMMITTEE $500
primary 02/19/82
WURZELBACHER, ROGER MRS
PHOENIX, AZ 85016
SELF-EMPLOYED DECONCINI, DENNIS (D)
Senate - AZ
DENNIS DECONCINI REELECTION COMMITTEE $500
primary 02/19/82

{"commentId":3571708,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"bmxc50"}

#39 - Sun Oct 19, 2008 4:23 AM EDT

{"commentId":3578940,"authorDomain":"deortrious81"}

Deortrious

You wonder why no one speaks up anymore. No one wants to lead.

If you go against what the media wants you got torn apart. You do well in school you get made fun of. You don't have a police record our an illegitimate child you are not a real man.

Actions like these are why we have such poor leaders running for president.

What a SAD TIME IN AMERICA! How did we ever get here? We used to be the country that had all the ideas and spoke up when we did not agree. We wanted to succeed and were proud of those that did. Now everyone just want something for nothing and look down on success.

Did you know that America produces 10 Lawyers for every 1 Engineer and Japan produces 10 Engineers for every 1 Lawyer? Guess everyone in America just likes to criticize the other and point out the problem rather that coming up with the solution.

{"commentId":3578940,"threadId":"390805","contentId":"2006917","authorDomain":"deortrious81"}

1 vote

#40 - Sun Oct 19, 2008 4:21 PM EDT

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J. RICHTER

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Joe the Plumber In-Law to Charles Keating? of the McCain S&L Scandal

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